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The Franklin Files -> Johnny Gosch Investigation -> Paul Bonacci
Post Info TOPIC: Paul Bonacci
Shadowman


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RE: Paul Bonacci
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Q. Okay. Dr. Mead, after he examined you, told the courts and the legislature, as I recall, and he testified before the legislature with you and I think that's part of your exhibits, part of your pleadings, that you had multiple personalities but that he believed your story. Is that correct?
 
A. Yes.
 
Q. Then you were examined by another psychiatrist ordered by the courts I believe?
 
A. Yeah. That was, she was from Immanuel, her mind slips me. Doc -- Stark? Dr. Stark or something like that, I'm not positive.
 
Q. Do you remember that examination?
 
A. Yes, I do.
 
Q. Do you remember what the results were there?
 
A. She concluded just as Dr. Mead did that I had multiple personality disorder and everything. They basically told me everything I said was true that I told her.
 
Q. Did you then have another examination by another doctor?
 
A. Yes, I did.
 
Q. Was that one paid for and ordered by the legislature of the State of Nebraska?
 
A. Yes, it was.
 
Q. Do you remember the name of that doctor?
 
A. Dr. Densen-Gerber.
 
Q. And it's my recollection, you correct me if I'm wrong, that you had extensive interviews with Dr. Densen-Gerber, is that correct?
 
A. Yeah. She came down and started several, I don't remember how it was, several hours, she went through many different personalities. And she, I don't know why she did it, but she had attempted to, several times and stuff, to have me say things that weren't true. But I corrected her every time because I wanted it to be known that, you know, what the truth was. And I found out later she did that on purpose, I believe to try and trip me up to see if I was telling a story if I was just making stuff up.
 
Q. Do you remember the conclusions she gave?
 
A. Yes, she came up with the same conclusion the other two psychiatrists had come up with.
 
Q. They believed you had been turned into multiple personalities as a result of sexual and other types of abuse, is that correct?
 
A. Yes.
 
Q. And that this had occurred at the hands of particularly Larry King and some of the other people you've named, is that correct?
 
A. Yes.
 
Q. I want to go back to the Johnny Gosch story. Who would be the best person that could tell me about that?
 
A. Me.
 
Q. Wesley?
 
A. Yes.
 
Q. And you believe Wesley can today because Mikey is integrated, is that right?
 
A. Yes.
 
Q. Did you participate in the kidnapping of Johnny Gosch?
 
A. Yes.
 
Q. Tell us about it.
 
A. It was through a guy named Emilio that I had met several years before while my family lived in Carter Lake, which I had met him down in, there's a, I don I even know what the name of that park is, I think might be Levi Carter, not really important, it's between the pond and big actual lake and stuff. I met Emilio through a kid that I had met down at the park and stuff. His name was Mike, or we called him Mikey too sometimes, but mainly Mike. He was approximately my age. And he told me about his friend and stuff. And when they, in talking to me and stuff they found out I had been abused and stuff, Mike had and stuff, he went, told Emilio. It was at this point Emilio started to begin to use me to go to these, not really parties, but just like, like child pornography, that's what his main thing was was making child porn. That's how he basically supported himself. And it was shortly after that that they asked me to go on a trip with them to Des Moines. And I believe that was around Labor, September, we left on September 4th of 82. And we went to Des Moines. We stayed there in a hotel which 1, all I know is it was on the, on the west side of Des Moines. And we, they went through what they were going to do. At first I didn't know what they were there for. The first thing, this one guy came in and says this is the one. And I at that point still had no clue as to what they were talking about and stuff. They said that, you know, they were going to take this kid, they were going to kidnap him and stuff. And I was a little bit upset. And I said that I wasn't wanting to go along with them. And I'm going to try to tell this in the best order that I can so that it's complete and put all the personalities together because I think in the past it's all been broken up. And I think what I need to do is put it altogether finally. And I can do that, the other personalities couldn't. What happened was when they took us to Des Moines, after found out, it was still early in the afternoon and stuff.
 


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Q. Who are we talking to?
 
A. Still Wesley. And it was still early in the afternoon and stuff by the time we got there.
This guy said this is the one they wanted and stuff. I as, I don ~ remember which personality it was, didn't want anything to do with it. Emilio took me for a little drive, stuck a gun in my head on a dirt road and told me I either did this or he was going to blow my brains out right there and then. At that point I agreed to go along with whatever, you know, they 'want and stuff. Went back to the hotel. That's where Tony, who is another guy, not me, he was an older guy and stuff. He had a lot of pock marks on his face, kind of skinny. He also can pose as a woman, which he has done on numerous occasions. He or Tony, myself, and Mike went into the other hotel room while Emilio, this guy named Sam and another guy talked in the hotel room. And were discussing, I guess, the details of how things were going to go down. Later on brought all three of us back in, Tony, myself and Mike, and they put up some chairs like it would be a car, and driving, and they said, this is how we're going to do it. You and Mike will be in the back seat when we pull up to where this kid's at and stuff, we're going to ask him a question.
We're going to go around the block. Which they did. Then they came back and stuff and they had myself and Mike out of the car, or Mike was in the car, I was out of the car and stuff. I went up to him, asked him a question. And at that point he was close enough tothe car where Tony had pulled up in a van and they pushed him in the car, and they had a rag with chloroform in the bag that they had us stick over his face. And then put it back in the bag after he was out. After that point they told all three of us to stay down in the back seat so nobody could see us. I think it was also so we couldn't see out to see where we were at. And at that point we drove several miles and stuff, we met up with a station wagon and a van several times and stuff. Which I know Tony was driving one of them, and this other guy, I believe name was Sam was driving the other. Several times they had us switch vehicles with Johnny and stuff. And eventually we ended up in the back of the van, a white van. And we drove from there, the car that had originally taken Johnny and drove east toward, they said that he was going to drive east toward like Chicago. And the station wagon that we transferred him into and stuff, they were going to have it driving going down south so that if anybody had seen anything and stuff they'd have it going out in different directions. But what they did was out in the country where there was nothing but corn fields and stuff where you couldn't see anything, they stopped and transferred him into the van. That's why nobody would ever see the actual vehicle that was going west toward Omaha. And we did stop, we did go through Council Bluffs because they made us stop at a place that I kind of know kind of well and stuff over in Council Bluffs. It was, at the time I believe it was called The Joker Lounge, which strangely enough is owned by, was owned by my, one of my uncles. And they went in, they just went in to get some drinks. And nothing that went on there. They left us out in the car. But that's when I peeked my head out. Cause they had a curtain in the van where you couldn't see out the front and they had curtains on the side on the side windows. It didn't have windows on the back but it had some side windows on the side too. I peeked out, that's when I seen The Joker Lounge and I recognized it because of the fact my uncle owned it. And I'm not sure if it was Fat Jacks or The Joker at that time, they've changed so many times. But then we drove up to Sioux City, Iowa. Which is where we stayed for the night. And the next day they took me back to Omaha. And --
 
Q. What happened that night?
 
A. That night at first Emilio and this couple other guys went into town to drink. And they left me, Mike and Johnny in a room that had no windows on it. That they had locked from the outside of the room and stuff. They lock us all three in this room. And that night when they got back they ordered me and Mike to do some things with, sexual things with Johnny. And they filmed it so that they could sell the film or whatever they were going to do with it. And then I know that they took me, the next day they took me back home. And then a couple of months later I got a chance to take a trip out to Colorado. And that's where I seen Johnny Gosch the second time. And at that point he was staying with a guy that I only knew as the colonel. And it was a kind of a ranch house but it was out, had a raised floor, underneath there was a space that had been dug out. And that's where they kept some of the kids at and stuff when they caused trouble or were bad. And they had a lot of lookouts on this road and stuff. If anyone was to even get close to the place that the kids could be taken up into the hills before anybody could ever get there. It was also the same place that in 92 when 1, 1992 or early 93 when I got out of prison where America's Most Wanted had taken myself and Roy Stephens to Colorado and stuff to see if I could find any of these places where they had taken us. And I had no idea that Roy had been in that same area. He'd never found the house. He had found elephant rock and some other places that stood out to, you know, would have stood out to anybody and stuff that had been in this house, because it's visible from the house. And he had been down that road. But I didn't find the main road that he, that you would think most people would find, because when they took us to this house they always took us up, I guess up the road and stuff where we have to take an old raggedy bridge across I believe the Arkansas River and alongside the river. And when they took us out there I was shocked, because as we were going on this road a guy popped out of the middle of nowhere with a radio, which I'm sure they could tell you that, this guy popped out and he had a radio and stuff. And I have never told anybody up to this time and stuff, but that's one of the guys who was involved.
 


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Q. Involved in the kidnapping?
 
A. Involved in the kidnapping.
 
Q. Did you know who he was?
 
A. I never knew his name. All I know he was close friend with the Colonel and arranged for auctions. And shortly, I mean, 1, shortly after we drove past him he went back up into the woods I believe, made some calls. And that's why we wouldn't have found nothing in that town. I think they knew in advance that we were there because we'd stayed in some hotels and stuff going out there and stuff. That I believe that they knew we were in the area and they hightailed it out. Because when we went to the other road that I had recognized and stuff we stopped at this guy's house who was a mailman. And shortly after we left his house he was hightailing it down to the trailer park which I had talked about. And I don't know, we don I know what happened because we just seen his mail truck going down to the trailer park and it wasn't a mail run because it was way too late for that.
 
Q. Okay, I'm going to interrupt you here because I know we probably want to get to lunch here. I have just one more witness, might take probably three to five minutes, I'd like to ask just a couple final questions. Alisha Owen, do you know her?
 
A. Yes, I do.
 
Q. Do you know Robert Wadman?
 
A. Yes, I do.
 
Q. Do you know Alan Baer?
 
A. Yes, I do.
 
Q. Do you know Larry King?
 
A. Yes, I do.
 
Q. Were all those people at these parties that you've heard described here today?
 
A. Yes, they were.
 
Q. Where were the parties?
 
A. Like I stated, a lot of them were at the Twin Towers. In various apartments and penthouses. Some were at a farm house. Some were actually at Larry King's house. Which was on a, all I know it had a big hill on it. It was nice, nice house and stuff. Also down in Washington, D. C. We had parties in Kansas City, couple of parties in some place in New York.
 
Q. What was the nature of these parties?
 
A. A lot of the parties when we went to, that we went to and stuff, the ones in the Twin Towers were basically for one reason. And that was for sex.
 
Q. Sex between who?
 
A. There was sex between adult men and some other adult men but most of it had to do with young boys and young girls.
 
Q. Young boys and young girls with each other or with older folks?
 
A. With the older folks. Also some of the parties, there was some parties above The French Cafe that they would bring people in and stuff that were from out of town. Those were specifically for sex with minors. Also in Washington, D. C. there were, there was also parties like Rusty had already talked about where there was parties after a party. Where they would have a party where they would have a legitimate party with like some politicians, businessmen. And a lot of them never knew about what happened at the after, you know, the party afterwards and stuff. Like in Washington, D. C. there was a lot of parties where they would be senators and congressmen who had nothing to do with the sexual stuff. But there was some senators and congressmen who stayed for the parties afterwards. And one person that I'm not afraid to talk about because his, because Larry King always said him and this guy were on the opposite ends of the field because this guy was a Democrat and Larry King was a Republican. That's a known fact and stuff. And this guy, every time I see him on TV and stuff, my wife knows my hatred for him. Because every time I see him and stuff it disgusts me because it's --his name is Barney Frank.
 
Q. Did you have relationships with him?
 
A. Yes.
 
Q. Where?
 
A. In Washington, D. C. And also I was sent to a house, I believe it was in Massachusetts in Boston where I believe it was his house because there's pictures on the wall that, with him and with different people and stuff. And that he had met I guess. But it was in his basement.
 
THE COURT: Mr. DeCamp, sorry, maybe we better break for lunch.
 
MR. DECAMP: Want to do it that way? Otherwise 15 minutes we can be done. We can break for lunch, whatever you say.
 
THE COURT: I think we better break for lunch. Can we come back, what, 1:00 o'clock?
 
MR. DECAMP: Yes, Your Honor.
 
THE COURT: All right. Be in recess till 1:00.
 
(12:04 to 1:00 p.m., recessed.)
 
THE COURT: Mr. DeCamp.
 
MR. DECAMP: Yes, Your Honor. Your Honor, I think probably take 10, 12 minutes with this witness, I have one other, then we should be done.
 


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THE COURT: Very well.
 
Q. (By Mr. DeCamp) Do you understand you're still under oath?
 
A. Yes.
 
Q. Okay. I just want to review a couple of the incidents of your life as you've laid out in your petition and some of the things that have been discussed here today. It's impossible for us to deal with anything more than just some very limited areas. But back to the Johnny Gosch incident. How was Johnny Gosch, how was this boy selected or was he selected specifically?
 
A. Well, the men came into the room, they had actually a couple of pictures, they had about five different pictures and stuff. They had pictures of Johnny and they also had pictures of other boys and stuff too. And the guy that I believe was Sam pointed at the one of Johnny and said this is the one. How he was selected I'm not exactly sure, but I know that they had several different photographs. And I know of the photographs, the pictures of the boys and stuff they had, one was of Johnny and stuff. He was carrying a paper sack with him on one of the pictures that I seen for sure. I'm not exactly sure how he was chosen or, you know. I know a lot of it had to do with the fact of the way he looked. Because the color of his hair and his eyes and everything. It could make them more money I guess. I --
 
Q. So it was not a random --
A. No.
 
Q. -- pick any kid, it was a specific targeted kid?
 
A. Yes.
 
Q. And he was identified the night before?
 
A. Yes.
 
Q. And you were with the people that did this?
 
A. Yes.
 
Q. And then you were used the next morning as a young, what, was one to lure him or something?
 
A. It was kind of like a, I don't know exactly what I was called, it was just more like I was, me and Mike were kind of used as bait. We were to -- because it's like when you see other kids and stuff you don't normally run. I mean, if an adult and stuff comes up and started asking a kid questions and stuff often times kids will run and get scared and stuff. But kids your own age are talking to you and stuff you normally aren't frightened by them. So we were there to, I guess you could say lure him or get him close enough to the car where we could get him in.
 
Q. Okay. You in an eight or nine day deposition we did discussed Alisha Owen, discussed a lot of personalities, and discussed Robert Wadman. And you had made a claim earlier under oath, as I recall, that you had seen Alisha Owen with Robert Wadman, is that correct?
 
A. Yes.
 
Q. And you were in fact charged with perjury because you made that statement to a grand jury, is that correct?
 
A. Yes.
 
Q. And those charges were dismissed against you, weren't they?
 
A. Yes.
 
Q. I'm going to ask you again today, you're under oath again, you're in a federal courtroom, did you ever see Robert Wadman with Alisha Owen?
 
A. Yes, I did. As I started to state earlier and stuff, I had seen them a couple of times and stuff, like I said, at the farm house and also at an apartment in the Twin Towers. And like I said, the one time in Twin Towers I walked in on them. And actually caught them in bed together.
 
Q. So you're saying you personally, Paul Bonacci, at the Twin Towers saw Police Chief Robert Wadman in bed with a girl we've come to know as Alisha Owen, is that correct?
 
A. Yes.
 
Q. Absolutely your certain?
 
A. One hundred percent.
 
Q. Did you see him with her in any other occasion in a compromising position?
 
A. Like I said, mainly just at the Twin Towers and stuff. And also at the farm house I seen them a couple of times together. And I'm not sure I seen them any other times besides that. I know some other personalities may have, you know, said the one time happened different times or stuff, it was just one occasion that they were actually in bed together that I seen them.
 
Q. And you say that knowing that Alisha Owen is in prison for saying that same thing?
 
A. Yes.
 
Q. Are you lying?
 
A. No.
 
Q. You're sure?
 
A. I'm positive.
 
Q. And you know you're under oath?
 
A. Yes. I'm as positive as I'm sitting here today and stuff that I know I'm one hundred percent sure that it was Robert Wadman and Alisha Owen.
 
Q. Did you know Alisha Owen?
 
A. I knew of her. I never really could stand her.


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Q. You and other young people got to know each other somewhat during this period of time you went to these parties?
 
A. Yes.
 
Q. How many of you were there involved in this?
 
A. it's kind of hard to say. Because I was in it probably longer than most of the young people that were involved. A lot of the young people were involved for a couple of years. Whereas I was involved from the early, either the late 70s, very early 80s up until even 86, 87. Even though I wasn't doing anything at that time and stuff, I was still around them enough to, you know, for photo ops or whatever Larry King wanted, enough to try to keep myself alive.
 
THE COURT: But for how long, from?
 
A. From, like I said, about the early 80s till 87, 88. And there were perhaps over that time period and stuff, I'm not just talking about kids from Omaha, and from Boys Town, cause there were several kids from Boys Town brought by bus, you know, brought in on vans and stuff. But also from the other areas where we went to and stuff on scavenger hunts for Larry, it was for Larry King. There's probably a couple of hundred kids. And as, from probably anywhere from 16 down to about 8, maybe some younger.
 
Q. (By Mr. DeCamp) You filed this lawsuit eight or nine years ago, is that correct?
 
A. Yes.
 
Q. Alan Baer originally was one of the defendants, is that correct?
 
A. Yes.
 
Q. Did Alan Baer ever have any contact with you after the lawsuit was filed?
 
A. He did in several different ways. Even after I got out of prison he's contacted me one time.
 
Q. What was the contact?
 
A. Well, in prison and stuff there was a guy in there named Bently Buckner who when I first got there he told me that he had been in contact with Alan. And said that he, Alan had told him to make sure I was okay and take care of me while I was there. Make sure nothing happened to me. And that had a lot to do with the fact there was a lot of pressure from some sources and stuff at that time that anything happened to me it would look pretty bad for him, too many people had already been ending up dead or something and I was just one that I, he wanted to make sure that I was taken care of
 
Q. Now, you were in prison for what?
 
A. I was in prison for three counts of sexual assault on a child. And what that extended to is that I got arrested for, the charge I got arrested on was for allegedly touching a 13 year old boy on the outside of his pants while I was supposed to be asleep.
 
Q. And your sentence for that was what?
 
A. I got a zero to five sentence, actually five years. I did all of the time that I was supposed to do.
 
Q. You were originally granted parole, weren't you, and then --
A. Yeah.
 
Q. -- an editorial came out in the World-Herald revoke, or telling them to revoke it and they did?
 
A. October 21st, 19911 went before the parole board, they voted unanimously at that time five to 0 to give me parole. And according, you know, we had a parole plan where I would be set up, I would be living with a minister in Lincoln and working for Ed Weaver, was what was set up for me at that time. And 10 days later before I ever got out of the prison the pastor I was supposed to be staying with was going to be out of a town for about a week or so so they couldn't let me go that day. But before I ever got out the World-Herald ran some pretty mean editorials and stuff saying that if I got out I'd be in touch with this LaRouche group which I won't have anything to do with because my brother ran away with one of them -- not my brother, my sister-in-law ran away with one of them. And so I had nothing to do with them really at that time. And it was after that Halloween, of all times, and stuff, of 91, October 31st, they revoked the parole and never gave a reason why. And that was pretty hard thing for me at that time.
 


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